> It isn't even difficult if you have any skill at all.
Very constructive, thank you.
I'm talking about the defaults of HTML. There's no pit of success, just lots of div-wrapping and tweaking until things fall into place. Compare with SwiftUI, where you plop two controls and they're spaced sensibly from one another without you doing anything. This was also the case in VB6.
> And then there's another person who didn't take the time to learn JS and just hates it for reasons.
I've been writing TS for awhile now, it's mostly fine. Should've expanded further: npm is a bit of a madhouse, and JS culture basically consists of "we shove JS everywhere we can and say it is good because it is JS."
> Show me a native app with a polished UI and any useful functionality in only 50-100loc.
I'll concede that. At 50-100loc, you can have a decent looking native app for a simple task. Presentation layer for a webapp blows through that immediately. Some of that is accepting the medium as is and learning to work with it. Some of it is also the fundamental impedance mismatch of the web writ documents/apps.
>There's no pit of success, just lots of div-wrapping and tweaking until things fall into place.
If you don't know what you're doing and plan things out, sure that is what you might expect - but that's a choice. And that's the same in any language or framework or platform. It's possible to write bloated unmaintainable UIs outside of JS/HTML.
>npm is a bit of a madhouse, and JS culture basically consists of "we shove JS everywhere we can and say it is good because it is JS."
Every package manager for every language is a bit of a "madhouse". It's the nature of free software. I'm not sure why you would expect JS programmers to not want to use JS packages, I'm not quite sure how you arrived at this sentiment.
>At 50-100loc, you can have a decent looking native app for a simple task.
Same with Javascript. You might be surprised what can be achieved in a few bytes of Javascript. Ever visit dwitter.net ? I think you're also leaving CSS out of the equation, which has very powerful styling capabilities. 10 or 20 lines of CSS can achieve a lot of UI styling for a simple app. The HTML/CSS/JS combination is very expressive, extremely powerful and easy to use. Not sure how you think it's somehow incapable of UI similar to native applications, without bloat, and easy to implement. I suppose it depends on your skill level with these tools, because I find it extremely easy to do. YMMV.
Very constructive, thank you.
I'm talking about the defaults of HTML. There's no pit of success, just lots of div-wrapping and tweaking until things fall into place. Compare with SwiftUI, where you plop two controls and they're spaced sensibly from one another without you doing anything. This was also the case in VB6.
> And then there's another person who didn't take the time to learn JS and just hates it for reasons.
I've been writing TS for awhile now, it's mostly fine. Should've expanded further: npm is a bit of a madhouse, and JS culture basically consists of "we shove JS everywhere we can and say it is good because it is JS."
> Show me a native app with a polished UI and any useful functionality in only 50-100loc.
I'll concede that. At 50-100loc, you can have a decent looking native app for a simple task. Presentation layer for a webapp blows through that immediately. Some of that is accepting the medium as is and learning to work with it. Some of it is also the fundamental impedance mismatch of the web writ documents/apps.